Real Salt Lake lose 2-0, but advance 3-2 over the Seattle Sounders - Quick Thoughts
by denz on Nov 2, 2011 10:40 PM MDT
Email
Print
That was the longest 90 minutes of the season, just like the match Saturday seemed to fly, this one seemed as if the clock couldn't move any slower.
I am not proud of how RSL played on Wednesday, but I don't believe it was dirty. In fact by the end of the match the Sounders had committed more fouls than RSL had, and both teams ended with two yellow cards. I thought the Sounders did an incredible job of pressuring the ball everywhere on the pitch, I think that perhaps all that pushing in the first half might have cost them in the end as the final 15 minutes the Sounders looked like they ran out of steam.
So just as we celebrated RSL being the better team on Saturday and cursed the Sounders for getting chippy, Wednesday provided the polar opposite. The Sounders were the better team, and RSL started the match rather chippy but both teams ended up playing that way.
As I look at the overall series there are simply two plays that may have been the difference and neither was made by a star of either team. On Saturday the late goal by Ned Grabavoy for RSL's 3rd goal, and Wednesday night the Tony Beltran clearance off the line of a sure goal. Of all the plays in both matches to me those two will stand out long after this season is over as the difference makers in this series.
OFF MY SOAPBOX
56 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
In 2009
I had the pleasure of watching a thoroughly engaging MLS Cup Final in which a fine RSL team took on and, in my view, outplayed a Galaxy team, going on to earn a thoroughly deserved title. This evening… well, it’s good to see RSL’s learnt something from their extended CCL run, I guess, it’s just a shame it wasn’t the skill aspect.
Not proud is putting it mildly; frankly your suggestion in the gamethread that anything Seattle did in in the weekend game came even close to RSL’s play tonight is hilarious. Congrats on the win; it truly galls me – especially given both teams’ antics in their first-leg playoff – that backing LA/NYRB in the conference final is the lesser of two evils.
I assure you
When an opponent’s deserved a result I’m the first to acknowledge it and offer my sincerest congratulations. Those are the sincerest congratulations this playoff series deserves.
more substance
what did you see from this series that disagreed with you…so much so that you now have to root for the winner of a series that ended in one of the most embarrassing pseudo brawls in the history of sport?
If I get the chance
I’ll try to oblige, but to be honest I can sum it up with 2 words: negative football.
I agree that SSFC were negative
Olonso should’ve been dismissed in the first leg for a petulant punch. montero should have been dismissed for accumulation of yellows (but didn’t get one) in the second leg. your team couldn’t beat a weakened RSL team that held almost NO possession. and even after all, the sounders got a soft penalty to get them kick started…AND STILL COULDN’T win. But cheer up, you always have sunny, balmy seattle to enjoy.
So I guess you’re right, sounders football was negative.
by exanteexpost on Nov 4, 2011 12:39 AM MDT up reply actions
Man, if only
I’d thought to TALK about Alonso’s actions somewhere else in the thread. How stupid of me to neglect to highlight my views on it not once, but twice!
Here’s the thing: Alonso’s push – because it was a push, not a punch – was noteworthy because it was an aberration, was clearly the worst offense by either team; there were very few others (apart from Friberg in the second leg, which is also already mentioned below) that stood out, particularly from the Sounders (I have to disagree with you on Montero, he didn’t put himself about all that much and he clearly got given more than he gave, though he should arguably have been booked for the foul on Rimando in the leadup to the disallowed goal; playing the player on high balls is a bad habit, and Fucito’s been doing it a bit recently as well). Gonzalez’s tackle in the second leg is the only other one that sticks in the memory, but it was rash rather than reckless, and he got carded for it. RSL’s tackling was harder throughout, which is fine until it’s taken to the point of recklessness, and that did happen sometimes. It was also accompanied by play acting that Charlie Davies would applaud and time wasting that was so egregious that if we were to describe the playing style as “playing on the counter”, the most important word in the description would be “the”.
your team couldn’t beat a weakened RSL team that held almost NO possession
Erm, I think you’ll find the final score begs to differ, sweetheart.
that is cute
if you really think you won last night, i don’t know what to tell you.
I know we've already established this
But your inability to differentiate between the two legs is frankly astonishing. Seattle lost the 2-leg playoff, I don’t see anyone disputing that? But quite apart from the fact that you apparently don’t even know what day of the week it is, you specifically said that they couldn’t beat “a weakened RSL team that held almost NO possession”, which patently doesn’t apply to both legs. Unless you disagree with RSL’s own head coach?
[Jason Kreis] I don’t think we’ve had that ability to pick our absolute strongest lineup since the first leg of the (CONCACAF Champions League) final at Monterrey."
If what you meant to say was that Seattle “couldn’t beat an RSL team over two legs, during one of which they were severely weakened and held almost no possession”, then you should actually say that, because, you know, everyone should strive to at least be in the ballpark once in a while, if only to avoid being decried for a fool by football fans the world over.
Nice to see you didn’t bother addressing the rest of what I said, too.
if seattle won
how come rsl was celebrating after the game?
Two short planks
I’m not sure words exist that are simple enough to explain it to you in a manner you’d be capable of comprehending.
i should probably be more polite
b/c i know sounders enjoy taking great pride in hollow victories…so here it goes:
well done on a second leg victory that ushered you out of the playoffs!
by exanteexpost on Nov 4, 2011 3:49 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
So you disagree with the officials?
According to the stats Seattle committed more fouls over the two matches, Seattle got more cards over the two matches. I always forget that when a RSL player goes for the ball on a challenge it is dirty if the Seattle player loses the ball but when Seattle does it, it is the RSL player diving. I always forget that if the Sounders lose there simply is nothing that can be said that will make them happy, there is always some reason why they lost that isn’t their fault. This time it is that RSL actually had to defend for most of the match due to the high pressure Seattle was putting on them, Saturday it was because every Sounder player had their worst match of the season.
Remember when you got mad at me because I said that some Sounders fans were thin skinned, and that some act as if MLS exists only because of Seattle. This is why I said those things.
Because despite your team picking up their first every playoff win, you lost the series and now in your mind there must be a justification that puts that blames that result on something other than the fact that you lost. So it is that RSL is a dirty team. Fine whatever, rant on.
For those Sounders fans who can deal with the loss, I say congrats on a great season, you did well. Good luck next spring in Champions League, I hope to see you guys in the final.
Yes
Either (or both) of Johnson’s tackles on Evans should have been carded – despite John Harkes ’ ludicrous commentary, Johnson went through Evans’ foot to knock the ball out of bounds.
Match stats concerning fouls and cards are meaningless in the poorly refereed MLS. RSL took what Marrufo gave them – all credit there – but don’t go quoting match stats to say that RSL didn’t do anything worse than Seattle.
Both games had a Seattle player push a Real player
Guess we broke even there in who deserved a card.
To my recollection
(and I do recollect correctly) my irritation at you was only at the suggestion that Sounders fans think that MLS revolves around them, not that they’re thin-skinned. The fact you mentioned both of those things in the same place does not make them the same thing.
Nor is it a matter of dealing with the loss itself – my nerves were rubbed far rawer by the loss my co-rec team suffered on Tuesday, which was THOROUGHLY UNDESERVED – and while over the two legs we arguably earned a shot at extra time, on the basis of our first-leg performance alone it would be a stretch to say we should have had any reasonably expectation to go through, so I bear no ill will towards RSL in that regard. Rather it’s the manner of the loss that stings; there are teams in the league that make it their raison d’etre to kick, and flop – oh how I will laugh the next time I hear an RSL fan complaining about soft fouls to the Rave Green – and dillydally their way to victory, and in the games I’ve seen RSL has not been one of them. You said as much yourself in your post.
As far as fouls and yellow cards go
The Sounders get a lot of fouls called against us, but if you’re just going by count alone then you’re barking up the wrong tree, because a lot of them really are tittle-tattle. How many did Levesque get called on last night, for example? It must be 6 or 7, and yet the majority were for blundering play rather than anything that was genuinely dirty; the yellow card he eventually got was as much for accumulation as anything else. Very few of our cautions are for, say, sliding through the back of a player to win the ball.
The simple fact is that we lost because we weren’t good enough. It’s as simple as that, and no fan is going to be happy with that. But that doesn’t mean that the observations those fans make aren’t valid.
Official recap shows 3 fouls for Levesque
Seems low to me, his card was definitely coming.
Thanks
It was a great season. I throughly enjoyed it. And thanks to RSL for a great series. We both got a fun match to watch and a painful one to watch. I did not like the end result and some of the calls but that is sports and I am sure you guys had plenty of calls you did not like either.
Good luck in the rest of the playoffs. I want SS to get in to group stage so I kinda want LA but in my heart I still want RSL.
Well done RSL
First off as a Sounders fan just waned to give my congratulaions for beating a solid Seattle team deservedly. So well done.
However, the conduct of Nick Rimando, for me was concerning. Obviously the yellow he received for “time wasting” was controversial however iwas what he did after the game, that was shown on television that concerned me. As soon as the whistle blew he turned to the supporters and flipped off the Seattle fans, at the same time yelling obscenities directed at the fans that do not belong in soccer. I want to say that this was a classless act, and I hope he is fined. Hoping for an apology as well.
It would be a shame
I hope that someone got a picture of it, or some video, without it there is nothing that can or will be done. I know each time it happens at Rio Tinto it upsets me when visiting players take part in those type of antics. Soccer is an emotional game but you hope players and fans can stay in control of their emotions.
Not sure if he flipped off the crowd...
…but he definitely gestured towards it. It’s something I’d like to see players do less of. Sure, the crowd is cheering against you and some fans cross the line, but at the end of the day the player winds up gesturing towards the fans that are jerks and the ones that are just there for the show. It’d be nice to see the players be the adults in these cases and just go celebrate with their team, but obviously that’s easier said than done.
I'm going to put this as nice as I can.
I love the RSL faithful. Going to the games is an enjoyment for me. Yet Seattle has a way of acting like a European club faithful. They are loud, crazy, and get under the skin of all players, just like you expect out of a Liverpool, Everton, Barcelona, etc.
When you act like that though, there is going to be some outragous antics. Am I saying that one day you guys might start throwing fireworks and what not on the field? No, but acting that way is going to get outragous antics back.
On the flipside
Some tosspot on the nearside touchline lobbed a half-full bottle of something onto the pitch as the clock ticked over into added time. I don’t think it came close to hitting anyone, but I hope security slung his arse out. Not acceptable.
Yeah, lobbing stuff on the pitch crosses the line
If C-Link security saw it…I’m sure the offender got tossed out.
The SAH Links Guy
Wow
Would never expect it from Rimando. But if he did do it, then that’s not right.
by Javi Hernandez on Nov 3, 2011 8:50 AM MDT up reply actions
Yeah, he's a professional but...
C’mon. You know how it is…The belligerent supporters who can’t respect any player from the opposition. Those ultras who think that acting like complete jerks proves what big soccer fans they are….I can’t blame Nicky for throwing it back at em’…
Let’s respect each other and the effort and work that all the players have put in to play at this level…
Too bad
It’s a shame if that is the case. Rimando is a great guy and seems to garner the respect of teammates, fans, and other players. Despite the heat he gets from the fans, he should be able to ignore it and not respond, as difficult as that is.
However, everyone makes mistakes. Right Alonso?
by Nussdorfer AC on Nov 3, 2011 12:41 PM MDT up reply actions
But really
He should stay profesional about it and let it be. I hung out with a bunch of sounder fans for the cup final and there are fun to be with. It is good to support your team, keep it up and good luck in CCL.
by Runnerboy3118 on Nov 3, 2011 2:24 PM MDT up reply actions
game
I don’t know if it was the gameplan, or if the players were just too worried about the back line, but going into a shell the first 10 minutes of the game really didn’t do us any favors. Bringing in Yordanny really saved us. Once that sub was made it seemed like the pressure eased off considerably. I really like Alvarez, he was a good pick up.
Agreed. When Kreis went with 4-5-1 we started to look dangerous. It was probably more due
When Kreis went with 4-5-1 we started to look dangerous. It was probably more due to the lack of energy left in the Sounders legs. However, there is no doubt that when Yordanny came in, a real sense of calm came over RSL. Hindsight is 20/20 but I wish we would have played the entire game that way. Even going to a 4-4-1-1 and leave Sabo in but keep him more in the midfield. It would have been nice to have him in for those late corners for both scoring and defending. I don’t think we had to hide that we were going to bunker down and defend the entire game.
RSL cheap shots?
Uh, Targaff, I don’t see you mentioning the name of alonso when you talk about cheap shots or the lack of cards being issued. I can’t believe even YOU can disaggree that alonso should have been red carded in the first game for that cheap and dirty foul against Sabo. I know you sounder fans hate Sabo, but that doesn’t excuse alonso’s crap!
Sure Alonso made one dumb foul last game, but Russel should at least have gotten a yellow as well
This last game, Johnson had at least 3 bad tackles going through evans which caused him to have to leave. Morales was making terrible tackles as well. Every tackle that first half the RSL players were putting that little extra in to make sure they got a piece of the player. They succeeded in making two players leave the game with injurys and largely effecting Montero’s play, IN THE FIRST 20 MINUTES. Yea Fernandez’s was a hamsting but he was getting just as hacked to pieces just like Montero and Evans were. At that point, it was an even larger mountain to climb and somehow we got two goals still.
Most of Seattle fouls were in the second half were when RSL players looking for the flop and Seattle trying desperately to get the ball. Not sliding and tackling through their legs. They were no where near the same level of borderline thugishness that RSL was giving out that first half, and half of RSLs bad challenges weren’t even called fouls.
You didn't see it?
Maybe you should try looking.
Given the ball was about 10 yards away, and Alonso wasn’t looking at the ball and went some distance out of his way to attack, "jostling position" doesn’t even come into it. It absolutely should’ve been a red, and I think the only reason it wasn’t was the fact that the appeared to keep his arms just below neck height combined with a general reticence on the part of the ref to issue cards. – Targaff
And another
What about the push from the sounders player on Morales before the free kick? Are you saying that didn’t deserve a card on that?? Good Grief, what game were you watching Targaff? Or are you just plain color blind? Green: Good guys who don’t cheap shot. Red: cheap shot artists. Is that what you see?
In that circumstance both players deserved a card
Marrufo figured he could get through the situation with “man management” or whatever, by just talking to the players, but really Marrufo could have avoided the whole situation by sternly telling Morales to back off the ball before Friberg had a chance to shove him. It was clearly a ceremonial kick with Montero being carted off for an injury, and Morales knew exactly what he was doing standing directly in front of the ball, and Friberg shouldn’t even have to ask for 10 yards there. It’s something that all teams do, but IMO, referees who don’t proactively deal with those situations are risking mass confrontation.
correction
Actually, Friberg does need to ask for the 10 yards. If the player is not 10 yards away he asks the referee for them. It is NOT mandatory for the player to back off 10 yards until the opposing player asks the ref and the referee tell him to back away. Morales did nothing wrong, nor did Murafo. Friberg failed to ask. Shoving a player is a yellow card. Friberg should have been carded.
In further evidence of your continued wrongness
There’s no requirement under the laws of the game for the team taking the free kick to request that an opposing player retreat 10 yards; quite to the contrary, that player is obliged to do so. The specific wording under Law 12 states:
A player is cautioned and shown the yellow card if he … [fails] to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner kick, free kick or throw-in.
Morales is committing a cautionable offence just by standing in front of the ball. Friberg is most definitely committing a cautionable offence by taking matters into his own hands and forcing the issue.
Since you seem to want to go through this incident by incident
I’ll quote verbatim my post regarding Friberg’s push from another site (I’d link to it, but it’s not a public forum):
That [Friberg’s push] may have deserved a yellow card. Compared to some of RSL’s tackling, though, it was positively tame, and as is ever the case the ref let it go.
Climb down from your claret and cobalt tower, grizz; so far you’ve chosen two incidents to try to make me look biased, yet both I’ve already commented on myself either here or elsewhere. I may wear green, but my specs don’t match – my comments come as a football fan first, Sounders fanboy a distant second.
whatever
I see things thru claret colored glasses as you see things thur green colored glasses. Bottom line, both teams put everything they had on the field for that game as it should be. Both teams got away with stuff, If you think you lost because we were thugs, that;s your opinion. The final thought was 2 great teams playing in the quarter finals where it is more suitable to be a semi final or for the cup. You guys have had a great year and still have CCL to look forward to. Good luck and it’s been fun sharing viewpoints with each other. And to be honest, you have been fair at looking at both sides.
by grizz17 on Nov 4, 2011 9:07 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
These aggregate series are really a 180-minute game with four quarters.
RSL did well enough in the first “half” of the game to merit the series victory. While the delay tactics in the second “half” were regrettable, every team in the league has some version of that which they employ when they are killing off a lead. It just happens that in this kind of contest, Salt Lake had 90 minutes left to protect their lead. I was a little surprised they didn’t go harder for a fourth goal at the beginning of the game, but given the conditions (rain, turf, no Borchers or Olave), it’s easier to err on the side of caution, I suppose.
I was a bit peeved at all the delay tactics last night, but after sleeping on it, I’m hoping RSL gets through past LA or NY. Good luck.
Refs
If the ref for the first game in SLC did his job and gave alonso the red he deserved in the 57th minute, Being a man down and the way RSL was playing, Seattle would have been looking at the LEAST a 4 goal deficit. Seattle needs to thank the idiot ref for allowing them to be only 3 down going home.
Flawed Logic
I agree completely that Alonso should have been red carded.
Where your assertion falls apart is when you say that the Sounders would have been looking at LEAST a four-goal deficit. In the 57th minute, Seattle still had 3 substitutions available. Sigi may have decided to substitute defense for offense, try to bunker and ride out the rest of the match down a man and two goals.
It may have been only a two-goal deficit and no Alonso for the second leg. It may have been six goals. We’ll never know because the ref only gave him a yellow.
Not to mention
Alonso was already borderline ineffectual during the first game, as RSL’s movement meant he was simply being bypassed. Removing him would arguably not have made a blind bit of difference to Seattle’s performance.
didn't he take the PK?
not sure what your rationale is behind removing alonso “wouldn’t ma[k]e a blind bit of difference.”
by exanteexpost on Nov 4, 2011 12:47 AM MDT up reply actions
try making a cogent argument
seriously, try.
by exanteexpost on Nov 4, 2011 11:15 AM MDT up reply actions
You seem utterly incapable
Of distinguishing between the first leg and the second leg. Which reading level do you want me to aim at? Kindergarten?
wow
no, i get your argument but i am not sure you do. your saying that it wouldn’t make a “blind bit of difference” for ssfc to play a man down for the second half in the first leg and lose Alonso for the second leg? you really believe that?
ok. i should stop bothering to persuade you at this point b/c you clearly aren’t reasonable.
Bottom Line
There’s no moral high ground for RSL or their fans to take from this playoff loss and series victory. The despicable style of soccer that was put on display by RSL on Wednesday was at least equally as bad as the incompetent style Seattle demonstrated on Saturday. For every cheap shot Seattle fans complain about that was administered by RSL on Wednesday, RSL fans have one in their pocket to counter with. Congratulations RSL, you won this race to the bottom. If Seattle had managed to finish one more of it’s many attempts on goal, completely digging themselves out of the hole they dug on Wednesday, there would be a very, very different conversation going on here. The complete backfire of RSL’s negative strategy would have been laid bare for all to see. Nevertheless, it worked this time and therefore deserves congratulations I suppose.
Regardless, I wish RSL luck in LA and based on their performance in the final 6 games of the season and their away leg at Seattle they’ll need a lot more than that.
Wow
OK, I am really thinking of locking comments on this thread because to be honest you all have gone beyond making me laugh and into the realm of giving me a headache.
Two simple points, Each team played their home leg as the dominant team, forcing the other side to abandon their normal style of play. In some minds that results in Seattle played awful on Saturday and RSL played dirty on Wednesday, to which I say BS, both teams responded to the offensive attacking style of the home side and both teams played chippy on defense.
Second point, fans of each side can claim to be not wearing tinted glasses when the look at the matches, but both are and at this point the comments are become a bit redundant and pointless. For those Seattle fans who need something to be mad about all off season, there you go you, should be happy now. For those RSL fans who wanted to get the goat of the Sounders fans, well there you go, you should be happy now
Two simple meta points
First, this is the most commented thread on your blog this year. There’s a lot to talk about here. Valid points are being made (regardless of whether you agree with them). Typically bloggers like people to read what they write and share their own opinions on the matter in the comments. Obviously you’ve said previously that you’re “not a journalist” (and yet you still get a press pass each season), but I want to believe that you at least consider yourself a blogger. Ironically, the second most commented post was the “game thread” posted a day earlier which had 50 comments (but you commented 16 times). This thread currently has 55 56 and you’ve only commented 3 times. Nobody’s swearing. Nobody’s making inappropriate personal attacks. Everyone’s sharing their legitimate thoughts on the game/series. You can shut down commenting because people are disagreeing with the way you saw things (RSL’s no worse than Seattle was), but at this point I think this thread is done anyways, so the “shut down” threat is hollow.
Second, I accept that you don’t like it when people see things differently than you and are willing to share. What’s annoying is how you respond. When your response continues to be a general attack on a fan base you think they belong to rather than responding to the points made by the commenter, it’s ad hominem and does nothing productive for the conversation. It just insults the commenter and sets a poor example.
by K61 on Nov 6, 2011 9:53 AM MST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on RSL Soapbox
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
